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      CommentAuthorLolcat
    • CommentTimeFeb 21st 2010 edited
     
    I haven't played 5 Color in a really long time. For fun, a week or so ago I brainstormed up a list. The basic idea is to control things until I can do one of 4 things, combo out with Painter's Servant/Grindstone, combo out with Sword of the Meek/Thopter Foundary, tinker up an Inkwell Levithan, or make a bunch of soldiers on my opponents end step with Decree of Justice. Heres what I came up with as a list.

    Black (31)
    1 Yawgmoth's Will
    3 Diabolic Edict
    4 Pernicious Deed
    1 Thopter Foundary
    4 Shadow of Doubt
    1 Yawgmoth's Bargian
    4 Contract from Below
    4 Tainted Pact
    1 Demonic Tutor
    1 Mind Twist
    1 Executioner's Capsule
    3 Dimir House Guard
    1 Vampiric Tutor
    1 Unearth
    1 Shriekmaw

    Blue (45)
    1 Fabricate
    1 Reshape
    1 Tinker
    1 Inkwell Levithan
    4 Tezzeret
    4 Trinket Mage
    1 Merchant Scroll
    1 Gifts Ungiven
    4 Counterspell
    4 Force of Will
    1 Intuition
    1 Future Sight
    4 Cryptic Command
    4 Fact and Fiction
    4 Thirst of Knowledge
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Muddle the Mixture
    1 Mystical Tutor

    Green (31)
    4 Rhox War Monk
    4 Kitchen Finks
    4 Loxodon Hierach
    1 Regrowth
    1 Eternal Witness
    4 Eldemeri's Call
    4 Voidslime
    4 Mystic Snake
    1 Sylvan Scrying
    1 Crop Rotation
    1 Life of the Loam
    1 Fastbond
    1 Worldly Tutor

    Red (25)
    4 Lightning Helix
    4 Lightning Bolt
    1 Gamble
    1 Recoup
    4 Sudden Shock
    1 Ancient Grudge
    1 Rack and Ruin
    4 Firespout
    4 Fire/Ice
    1 Hull Breach

    White (37)
    1 Enlightened Tutor
    2 Decree of Justice
    4 Vindicate
    4 Aven Mindsensor
    4 Swords
    4 Path to Exile
    4 Oblivion Ring
    1 Academy Rector
    1 Ray of Revelation
    1 Balance
    1 Moat
    4 Wrath of God
    1 Dispeller's Capsule
    1 Stoneforge Mystic
    4 Absorb

    Artifact (31)
    1 Grindstone
    4 Painter's Servant
    4 Etched Oracle
    1 Sword of the Meek
    4 Divining Top
    4 Engineered Explosives
    4 Mind Stone
    4 Felwar Stone
    1 Relic of Progenitus
    1 Zuran Orb
    1 Crucible of Worlds
    1 Sword of the Meek
    1 Skullclamp

    Land (100)
    1 Academy Ruins
    40 Duals
    20 Fetches
    4 Exotic Orchard
    1 Tolarian Academy
    1 Stripmine
    1 Tolaria West
    4 Wasteland
    4 Celestial Collande
    5 Island
    3 Plains
    2 Forest
    2 Swamp
    1 Mountain
    4 Maze of Ith
    1 Volrath's Stronghold
    1 Kor Haven
    1 Dustbowl
    4 Krosan Verge

    Another thing to note is that I went for two tool boxes: one with artifacts and one with creatures, since a have a lot of ways to search for them.

    I'm basically just looking suggestions on card choices and just ways to improve the deck in general.

    *also this is pretty offtopic but I was wondering if anyone know of an up to date Enchantress list? Thats a 5 color that I always liked.

    EDIT: Forgot to add this is semi-budget. I realize some cards would be better, like switching the deck to time vault combo. Using Mana Drains ect.
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      CommentAuthorDipstik
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    We allow proxies now... use whatever cards you like. And yes, you should be running power and key/vault.
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      CommentAuthorLolcat
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    Curious, what is an acceptable way to create proxies? Is there a better way then writing on a random card with a sharpie? Or do people print a card out and glue it to a random card?
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      CommentAuthorDipstik
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    Sharpies work well. At the last tournament I went to I had to make like 80 proxies, so I printed them out, cut out the images, and slipped them into the sleeves on top of the cards. They were easier to read, but Franson raised a minor (for him) stink about it. If you went to a big T1 tournament with proxies like that they wouldn't let you use them because the cards are slightly thicker.
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      CommentAuthorc-crew
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    How do proxies work with ante?

    We are playing 30 per color right? List only has 25 red.
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      CommentAuthorJD.5
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    I would personally recommend taking out Absorb and replace it with either A.) 3+ more Stoneforge Mystic, B.) 4+ Steelshaper's Gift, or C.) Both A and B. If anything, adding these cards make the Thopter Foundry/Sword of the Meek combo much easier to find.

    On top of that, why only 1 Reshape? It is unrestricted as far as I am aware. This thing is practically a tutor for any of your win conditions. On this note (and I know I was just talking about how bad the card is on a different thread), what about Wargate? Tutor into play 4 more win conditions seems great.

    I think the idea of holding the ground is great, but you should be more focused on how quickly and efficiently you can get your combo pieces out. Certain cards just seem straight out of place to me in your deck, such as Rhox War Monk, Etched Oracle, and the single Unearth being of this category.

    Just thoughts man. Hope these helped.
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      CommentAuthorLolcat
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2010
     
    Thank you for the kind, courteous, and helpful feedback on levels. I sincerely appreciate it.

    @Dipstik - thanks for the tip, I'm not too worried about the cards being slightly bigger. I play 5 color and magic in general for fun and mainly with friends. Cheating just doesn't really have a place there.

    @c-crew - I was just looking at the homepage after an extended absence and it says 25. If its different someone let me know and I can promptly add 5 more red cards.

    @ JD.5 - Thanks for the suggestions. I was thinking Reshape was restricted but I was wrong on that one. I really like the idea of Wargate, I didn't even know that card existed. As for Rhox War Monk and Etched Oracle, are there to hold the ground while gaining life / some cards. I get what your saying about these two cards, I just like them and I agree with you that cutting them could make the deck a little tighter. The single Unearth is for Gifts Ungiven, Gifts for Painter's Servant, Grindstone, Regrowth, and Unearth basically grabs the combo in one way or another. I thought about cutting it out but even if I draw it I can cycle it and it can pull a few guys in my deck out of the grave so its not bad at all. Sometime when I have some more time I'll play around with your suggestions.

    Thanks again all.
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      CommentAuthorDipstik
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2010
     
    proxies don't work with ante. Proxies are for tournaments, Ante is for fun. Don't proxy when playing for ante.
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      CommentAuthorJD.5
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2010
     
    Nice interaction with Unearth. In that case, I would certianly keep it in there. I didn't catch that upon first glimpse.
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      CommentAuthorJD.5
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2010
     
    How do you feel abot switching out Counterspell for either Misdirection or Remand? Misdirection is great as a psuedo-Force 5-8 while Remand is an awesome tempo destroyer that allows you a free cantrip.
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      CommentAuthorLolcat
    • CommentTimeFeb 25th 2010
     
    I can bite at Misdirection, would be a nice way to protect the combo without mana up. It protecting Grindstone et al might be sorta flimsy but it can probably protect Painter fairly well, as he is a creature. I have an aversion to Remand from when I played it back in type 2. Almost every time I played I would have preferred a hard counter with no cantrip. However, that was in a straight control deck and this is combo. I realize popping that removal spell back to the hand for one turn could make all the difference. I'll give it more thought.

    The past couple days I've been brainstorming up an idea for an enchantress deck. However, the fact that Sigil of the Empty Throne and Replish apparently don't combo makes me very sad indeed. =(
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      CommentAuthorJD.5
    • CommentTimeFeb 25th 2010
     
    Makes plenty of sense. However, think of Remand in this light:

    A good Magic player is always (well, most of the time) going to bait you with spells that have an effect that is something to be aware of but not overly concerned for. Then, when they realize you are tapped out or have no cards in hand, they cast that Balance, Contract, or Yawg Win and break your face open like Edward Norton in American History X. Remand, although not technically a "hard counter", is a ridiculous tempo stopper. What it does it lull your opponent into a false sense of security. "Oh, he didn't counter that Vindicate to his massively threatening creature? Hmm, my guess is he won't mind this Contract than."
    "But alas, I have balls that need to be licked," you say as you notice he tapped his only remaining black source. SUre, that Contract is going to be back again next turn, but how in the hell does he know you didn't just draw Arcane Denial, Force of Will, or my super secret tech: Envelop?

    Although this may be a rather small ideal of how it could work, think of it in this light:

    Turn one, you drop some land, throw down a Top, and ship the turn.
    Turn one opponent, they throw a land down and wish they had big balls also. They ship turn.
    Turn two, you drop land numero dos, see the Remand in your hand, and ship turn.
    Turn two opponent, they say "Freeze bitch!" and throw down their Chaos Orb, you tell them to shut it and show them Remand, and they whimper... until next turn at least which is when you will have an answer for it anyway.

    In any vein, you can look at Remand in one of two ways depending upon game state: Deterrent or Time Walk. Go ahead, make fun of me for calling it a Time Walk but it certainly feels like that inthe early turns, especially if you counter a mana-screwed opponent's Felwar Stone. PRICELESS. Oh you cast this big spell, well did you want to cast it again? Yeah, that's what I thought.

    END RANT ON REMAND.

    Misdirection gets quite a bit of hate from different sects of players but I always like to think of it as either one of these two things: A.) A Counterspell or B.)My opponent's best target spells used against him. Yeah, sure, you may think it is a 2 for 1 with you on the losing end, but really you are using their spell (1 card) against one of their cards or permanents (card number 2). I consider that far greater since they went through all the hassle of paying mana for it while you just discarded some useless jank you were holding in your hand. Seems good.

    Alright... oh, one more thing. Lose the Voidslime. That card is garbage. If you are trying to use it for a utility card, I'd give you more tech points for playing Seedtime to be honest. But if you are using it strictly as an off color Stifle, use Bind and rip a card.
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      CommentAuthorzombor
    • CommentTimeFeb 25th 2010
     

    but how in the hell does he know you didn't just draw Arcane Denial

    Because good players don't play bad cards ;)

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      CommentAuthorDipstik
    • CommentTimeFeb 26th 2010
     
    excuse me, zombor, but I have balls that need to be licked.
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      CommentAuthorJD.5
    • CommentTimeFeb 26th 2010
     
    Posted By: zombor

    but how in the hell does he know you didn't just draw Arcane Denial

    Because good players don't play bad cards ;)



    Yeah right, Arcane Denial, for it's cost, is still not a bad card. If it isn't an exceedingly heavy blue deck than I see no reason not to play an extremely easy on the mana hard counter. Afterall, who cares if they rip two cards off of it, who counters anything less than broken with Arcane Denial anyway?
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      CommentAuthorzombor
    • CommentTimeFeb 28th 2010
     

    This isn't 1998. We have better cards now than Arcane Denial.